My sojourn in RCCG and the hand of God upon my life-Pst Wale Adeduro (2)

Here is the concluding part of the interview with Pastor Wale Adeduro, Provincial Pastor of Redeemed Christian Church of God Lagos Province 76. You can start reading from https://churchtimesnigeria.net/my-sojourn-in-rccg-and-the-hand-of-god-over-my-life-pst-wale-adeduro-1/

You’re heavy in the area of support for people. What has been the experience?

Christianity is all about helping people and getting help. God offered his son to the world to save us from our sins. He knew we needed help. The book of Isaiah 6v8 made us understand that God also needed help. He asked the question, who will go for us? We are primarily in the ministry of help. Whatever we do is to help people. We are all also helping God to reach out to people who need help. God created Adam to help him manage the earth. Eve was also created to help Adam. We are all helpers. I think people should be happy when they are being called to help because it means they are fulfilling destiny.

But how easy is it to be happy to render help when you also have your challenges?

Helping people is a destiny call. Not everybody will understand this. The will of God is for us to help the world become a better place. I grew up with parents who were living in a room apartment. And we always had four dependants outside our family at every given point. I grew up to see my parents helping people and paying school fees of people. That is how I also raise my children.

In the African system, everybody grew up receiving help. When we were born, our aunties, and neighbours supported our parents to take care of us. To me, by helping people you are appreciating what God has done for you. It is like a tribute you are paying for being alive. It is a form of sacrifice. In my 34 years of marriage over 50 people have lived with us at one point or the other. I mean each of those people spent more than six months with us at a stretch. God has used us to help a lot of people to go to school and even travel abroad when we had not.

This must have sometimes put you into trouble.

Yes. It has put us in trouble at different points. There was somebody I helped. He lived in my house for about 2 years. But he turned around and wanted me dead. He wanted to destroy my ministry completely.

I have had the case of a young man who came to live with us as a home help and we wanted to train him to get to the university. He came home one night and had a stomach problem. It occurred to me that I did not know any of his people. If something bad had happened to him, we would have been in trouble.

We had cases of married people who had challenges with accommodation living with us. Not once, not twice. When people live with you, they only remember what you did not do well. We had issues where people felt entitled. A lady called us around 2 am and said she had a problem with her accommodation. She was a single lady. She said she wanted to stay with us for two nights but ended up staying for two years. It was tough getting her to go.

But how did your wife cope with all of these?

She also grew up with parents who accommodated people. It’s not new to her. We were trained that way. But then I agree helping people comes with its challenges. Some people feel entitled and sometimes they feel you are not doing enough.

Has helping people made you want to go beyond your limit?

Yes. That was in the past. I used to think I had a responsibility to help everybody who asked for my help until my daughter told me to stop trying to be the father of all. I discover that whether you help them or not they will not die. I used to help people pay school fees while I had not paid for my child. I could easily delay my payment because I knew the principal. But I would pay for others. But I had to stop when my last child said to me one day: Don’t de-rep me. That was the first time I heard such word, meaning I should not puncture her reputation before the school by owing. She said she would rather stay at home until the fees are paid.

That made me rethink and also appreciate that my primary responsibility is to my biological children. But I still feel guilty if people need help and I can’t help. I used to borrow money to help people. But over time I have learned not to borrow again to help people. I can only be a guarantor. That has also been a challenge because you stand as a guarantor for people and they won’t pay back the loan. I have had to pay back money borrowed by people that I stood for as guarantor.

The good thing about it is that it has not affected our marriage. Some people try to create problems but my wife is very understanding and spiritual. She has an inkling before anything untoward happens because she is very prayerful and supportive.

You had your challenges, especially concerning your health. What went wrong and how did you overcome?

I have had two major health challenges. First was the consequence of a major accident in Calabar while working on the Calabar festival in December 2005. I had a spinal cord injury. I was told I would never walk again. I was taken to the National Hospital in Abuja after the accident. One Dr Ajuwon who was the personal doctor of former President Olusegun Obasanjo and a team of doctors said I would not walk again. I had a C fracture on the neck. But miraculously I started walking again.

How did the miracle happen?

After the accident, there were plans to take me to Germany when it had been confirmed I had a spinal cord injury and that I would not walk again. But the miracle happened in Abuja. I was in the waiting room sitting in a wheelchair with POP on my neck. The consultants were having meetings and discussing my case. I had prayed and taken holy communion. I said to the Lord since the legs of Jesus were not broken, my leg would not be broken.

So, they kept me in the wheelchair and were discussing what to do about my case. I became impatient because it seemed they were keeping me in suspense. It was out of that impatience and annoyance that I jumped out of the wheelchair. The wheelchair somersaulted. The doctors rushed and wanted to push me back to the wheelchair because I was supposed to be paralysed. They felt I was going to collapse for attempting to walk by all means.

But I refused to succumb to their move. I said God had healed me. And truly I did not fall. My feet were firmly on the ground. After that experience, I asked to be transferred to Lagos where Dr. Ugbeyen took over.

So, when we got to Lagos, we had another test and it was discovered that nothing was wrong with me. This was contrary to the result of the test we had in Calabar and Abuja which showed I had a C fracture. The test in Lagos confirmed I was free of the diagnosis. But I was still having this pain occasionally. I was praying and God told me he had healed me.

Suddenly I had a client who wanted me to go to China with him. I said I could not go because I could not sit for more than 10 minutes I would begin to feel bitting pain. But God told me to go and that was it. I went to China in April 2006 and came back. That was the end.

And then you had an issue with your kidney too?

Yes. I had kidney failure in October 2020. But the problem with my kidneys started in 2012. That was when I started taking treatment. I was satisfied okay in 2016. When COVID came I was warned to be very careful not to have the attack because covid destroys organs. Unfortunately, I had three attacks of covid and I did not go out. That attack finished the work.  But God also took control. It’s a long story. The bottom line is that God healed me. The details are in my book, Sustained Beyond the Dying Field: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/75413191-sustained-beyond-the-dying-field

Looking back now, I think that my habit was contributory to kidney failure. I had embarked on several dry fasts. I remember going on a 40-day dry fast on eight different occasions. During the first three days of those fast, I would drink no water and I would now begin to take juice once a day. Lack of water in the system must have been the major cause. I tell people if they are fasting regardless of where they are, they should drink water. We did fast without being told how to fast. I did 7 days dry every month for over 20 years. I did 14 days dry fast three times a year for about 25 years.

All those things affected my kidney. We were not using wisdom. Looking back, I ask myself why would someone fast and not take water for the first three days. And I was active on the road. But God has been faithful. If not for God, I would not have survived it. In December 2012, I met Pastor Adeboye and brought the case to him and he told me God wanted to prove to me that he could sustain me. He said God wanted me to stop running around to focus on his work.  Truly, at that time I was always running around doing one project or the other.

It’s been about four years since the health issue. God has been faithful. It is expensive to do a transplant and four times more expensive to maintain the transplant. But God has sustained us. We did not have to beg for money. After I survived the kidney failure, I came down with an enlarged heart, enlarged prostate, diabetes, and poor sight.

Between April 2021 and June 2023, I spent an average of 20 days in the hospital regularly. But God has been faithful. I have been confirmed free from enlarged heart, prostrate, and diabetes. In all these, God used me to cure a man who had kidney disease. He read my book and came for prayers and God cured him some weeks later. Doctors confirmed it. It is two years now that the man has been cured. God has used me to support people who have kidney failure. People I don’t know call me and I counsel them. People are happier and more confident to face their issues when they read my story. I now encourage a lot of people to trust God in their condition.

God intervened in the whole matter concerning your health. But beyond prayers what are the wisdom nuggets you will love to share?

I think the first thing we must understand is that we are stewards of God’s gifts and we should be accountable for the life that He gave us. Most of these terminal diseases don’t happen in 10 years. They give signs before they happen. A young man is was fasting and not drinking water may not escape kidney problems.

Our body systems are different. So don’t imitate anybody. Take good care of what you eat and drink. The body is about 70 percent of water. We need to take more water, pure crystal water, and do regular exercise. I try to walk for one hour every day. We need to be aware of our health status. We need to also understand what runs in our families. Some diseases are generational. If diabetes is common in your lineage, you can avoid it if you control your diet.

Don’t expose children to white substances like sugar, and salt. Reduce carbohydrates for children. We must eat more vegetables and eat a balanced diet. Since I was age 11, I hardly slept for more than four hours. I used to take pride in saying I was the one who would wake up seniors in the night. I don’t go to bed until 1 am and would wake up by 5 am. When I was sick it was the same thing, I was given a drug to sleep for three days but I woke up after six hours. And the doctors told me that I was destroying my system.

I think we have a lot to learn from Baba Adeboye who for instance does not joke with his health.  He is still standing strong at 82 because he takes care of his health. What you call a prayer walk is spiritual but also physical. He exercises every night. He walks for about three hours every night without fail. We needed to learn to rest so we don’t become like a man of God who died at 38. He was a powerful man of God. He would eat late in the night and became obese. God warned him. But he thought anointing was enough.

We need to take care of our health. I am a victim of not taking care of my health. Some people say it was an attack. But the attack found a good ground to operate. Covid came and worsened the whole thing. God is showing that he is supreme, that is why I am still alive.

Thanks so much for those wisdom nuggets. Church leaders have lately been involved in doctrinal battles. How will you react to this given your experience as a mentor to many pastors?

The first thing I would say is that what we are going through is unfortunate. There is self-destruction going on in the body of Christ. And I am not speaking on behalf of anybody. I am speaking on behalf of myself having been saved by the blood of Jesus in 1979. We are disrupting the body of Christ. I liken this to a situation where children of the same parents are fighting over things that have to do with the culture of the family.

Instead of sitting down to talk over it in our closet, we go out to wash our linen publicly. At the end of the day, it is our family that will suffer for it. What is happening is making some people have more online followers. But those who are benefitting more are the Youtubers and the online business merchants. But the body of Christ is not gaining. anything.

There are a lot of people who are not in the fold yet. Those of us in the fold are destroying the fold because some people think they have superior knowledge.

I am a grandfather now, how are we going to attract our grandchildren to the faith? Christianity is more than avoiding worldliness. Christianity is not about condemning people. Trying to personify Christianity is where we are having a problem. Nobody can say he is an authority of the faith. We quote Paul, but Paul did not claim to be an authority. He made some statements and said they were his own commands not of the Lord. We are having problems because we want to personify Christianity. As much as possible, it should be about love for God and love for fellow man.

We can criticise, but we cannot criticise people’s experiences. I have had kidney failure. But doctors tell me I have been cured of kidney failure. I had an enlarged heart, an enlarged prostate, and diabetes. I had a spinal cord injury and was told I would never walk again. But I am walking today.

You can’t subject that to any doctrine. Faith in God is not questionable. Yes, there are excesses here and there. The issue of somebody trying to be a reformer in the Body of Christ is not new. We have had reformers like Martin Luther in the past. But I think we must correct in love. We don’t have to throw up the mud. You can’t come to the public and call a man a criminal when the man has not been sentenced. That would be presumptuous. For me I would say in all honesty, we need to go back to the cross and build our faith based on the words of Jesus and his principles. If Jesus were alive, would he do it the way we are doing it?

For me, Christian theology is a summary of our understanding of the Bible and not essentially the Bible.  The Bible can’t be subjected to different interpretations.  The basic message of the Bible is that people be born again. We sinned, we are to repent and make a U-turn and prepare to make heaven.

But then the Bible enjoins us to test whatever we are doing according to Phil 4v8-10. Is it a good report, is it of praise, etc? Somebody says I used to collect tithe and I don’t collect tithe anymore. But I have not come to that understanding. So, in trying to make me understand, you that is knowledgeable must do so in love. But then, I also know there is something called restitution. If you used to collect tithe and you no longer collect have you made restitution?

For me, the fundamentals of doctrines are based on the book of Acts 2v37-42. Peter focused on some elements. He talked about salvation, repentance, baptism, the teaching of the apostles, the breaking of bread, and prayer. The doctrines you are talking about if they are not around these things, it is not of good report. 

For instance, it was Pastor M.O.Ojo who led me to Christ, years another person did baptism for me, a man laid hands on me and I received the holy ghost. Pastor Adeboye commissioned me to the ministry.  Pa Akindayomi was the pastor of the church when I gave my life to Christ. Who then is my father among these people?.

For me, we should walk away from those things that don’t edify. What will not make people repent of their sins and love God is extraneous. Doctrines are our belief system. Nobody is an authority of the Christian faith. Paul had been in ministry for 29 years when he said, that I may know him. He said when I was a child, I spoke like a child.

With what have gone through in the last three years, I can face a moving train. God had used me to heal a lame woman and I have experienced healing myself. So it will be hard for anybody to convince me that miracle is a fluke.

I think we should avoid being a stronghold in the Body of Christ. We need to season our words with salt. Col 4v6 gives us that admonition. There must be evidence of sanctification in our choice of words. One of the things that will show whether I am sanctified or not is my speech. If what I do does not show love and will not attract people to Jesus there is no point doing it.

Ministerial success is the discovery and fulfillment of God’s purpose. I am beginning to feel successful because I am doing what God wants me to do.  Success is a sustainable positive influence. I have helped people in the past, but if I am not able to help again, I have not succeeded.